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Ep.176: Leonard Marshall & Ricky Williams

Cannabis Economy Podcast
Ep.176: Leonard Marshall & Ricky Williams

Ep.176: Leonard Marshall & Ricky Williams

Two time Super Bowl champion Leonard Marshall joins us to discuss CTE, PTSD and cannabis as medicine. He talks about the disconnect of benefits for the “pre-98” retirees from the NFL and his current work with Brain Unity Trust. He talks about his work on the movie Concussion and that- in his words- “it didn’t need to get to this point.” And then Ricky Williams joins us to discuss goal setting which he credits for how he won the Heisman Trophy and of course his unique relationship and thoughts on cannabis. We were shooting for Family, Business- documentary on the Williams Family running Medicine Man so he opens with the fact that there’s no relation and that the connection comes from mutual friend Liz Nichols.  Ricky Williams preceded by Leonard Marshall

Transcript:

Speaker 1: Okay, so they're super bowl champions sitting right across from me. This is Leonard Marshall Number 70. I want you, man. I thank you for the superbowl that we both went together. You're quite welcome, seth, you know quite well and you're wearing the right. Oh, that's nice. That's nice. A Nice, right? Yeah. Now are you still in the tristate area? I'm in the tristate area. All that kind of go back and forth between here and Boca Raton, Florida. That's nice down there. Yeah, I love it. I love it. I love South Florida. Where are you from originally? I'm from Louisiana. I believe it or not. Sure. I believe that. Yeah. And so how close to New Orleans? Because that's all we know right now. About Ninety to 90 to 100 miles from New Orleans. So you know how to cook food. I know how to cook food. You know how to listen to music.

Speaker 1: Listen to music. Yeah. So you Allen, Tucson, you fancy Clifton, Shania to. Oh there you rock. And do ipsy bag. That's it. Absolutely. And of course the Neville brothers and they never bothered. There we go. Alright. So we've got definitely from Louisiana. They bought all roulette. So did you go to Lsu? Where'd you go to Lsu? Lsu Undergrad. And uh, I got my graduate degree here at Fairleigh Dickinson in New Jersey and I continued my education at Seton Hall University six years. No, I continued it all. Um, uh, worked on my mba there, got my certification in management there and uh, and spent some time they're teaching for a minute. There we go. Alright. So teaching then, what are you doing now? Why are you and I at academy? Well now I'm involved in and a number of things philanthropically. The main thing I'm involved in is my organization called Brain Unity Trust.

Speaker 1: And because of brand new and trust in a, my awareness of cte or the acronym cte, which is chronic traumatic encephalopathy, being that I was diagnosed in 2013 with this science of this issue, way late, way late, uh, uh, some, some 13, 15, 17 years after I'm retired, I'm thinking I need to come to understand this a little bit more and coming understanding a little bit more. I began to align myself with companies that deal with players, both current, former and retired, who are having these issues and how to find alternative applications other than pharmaceutical drugs to deal with these problems as they arise and as they become worse. So in the past, since 2000 and probably six, I've witnessed and notice about 12 to 17 and my friends die, die from issues like this, um, seven years most. I've also written a book about this 10 years.

Speaker 1: Yeah. Entitled when the cheering stops, I've worked on a film which is probably the hottest film in the country, football wise and very real entitled concussions which featured Will Smith you were part of that film. Right. And, and I have come to know one of the top lawyers on a very personal level who filed originally filed the concussion claim against the national football league, which I was one of the first guys to, to do that in 2011. So, so being that this space has been sort of in the backdrop of my cv for the last five or six years. Yeah. Uh, you know, this has a treatment to the impaired. Yeah, other than prescription medication has become very interesting and intriguing to me. And you kind of jumped in with both feet, both feet jumped in both feet. So, uh, I, I'm, I'm feeling that you're a little bit of an educator.

Speaker 1: Okay, so they're super bowl champions sitting right across from me. This is Leonard Marshall Number 70. I want you, man. I thank you for the superbowl that we both went together. You're quite welcome, seth, you know quite well and you're wearing the right. Oh, that's nice. That's nice. A Nice, right? Yeah. Now are you still in the tristate area? I'm in the tristate area. All that kind of go back and forth between here and Boca Raton, Florida. That's nice down there. Yeah, I love it. I love it. I love South Florida. Where are you from originally? I'm from Louisiana. I believe it or not. Sure. I believe that. Yeah. And so how close to New Orleans? Because that's all we know right now. About Ninety to 90 to 100 miles from New Orleans. So you know how to cook food. I know how to cook food. You know how to listen to music.

Speaker 1: Listen to music. Yeah. So you Allen, Tucson, you fancy Clifton, Shania to. Oh there you rock. And do ipsy bag. That's it. Absolutely. And of course the Neville brothers and they never bothered. There we go. Alright. So we've got definitely from Louisiana. They bought all roulette. So did you go to Lsu? Where'd you go to Lsu? Lsu Undergrad. And uh, I got my graduate degree here at Fairleigh Dickinson in New Jersey and I continued my education at Seton Hall University six years. No, I continued it all. Um, uh, worked on my mba there, got my certification in management there and uh, and spent some time they're teaching for a minute. There we go. Alright. So teaching then, what are you doing now? Why are you and I at academy? Well now I'm involved in and a number of things philanthropically. The main thing I'm involved in is my organization called Brain Unity Trust.

Speaker 1: And because of brand new and trust in a, my awareness of cte or the acronym cte, which is chronic traumatic encephalopathy, being that I was diagnosed in 2013 with this science of this issue, way late, way late, uh, uh, some, some 13, 15, 17 years after I'm retired, I'm thinking I need to come to understand this a little bit more and coming understanding a little bit more. I began to align myself with companies that deal with players, both current, former and retired, who are having these issues and how to find alternative applications other than pharmaceutical drugs to deal with these problems as they arise and as they become worse. So in the past, since 2000 and probably six, I've witnessed and notice about 12 to 17 and my friends die, die from issues like this, um, seven years most. I've also written a book about this 10 years.

Speaker 1: Yeah. Entitled when the cheering stops, I've worked on a film which is probably the hottest film in the country, football wise and very real entitled concussions which featured Will Smith you were part of that film. Right. And, and I have come to know one of the top lawyers on a very personal level who filed originally filed the concussion claim against the national football league, which I was one of the first guys to, to do that in 2011. So, so being that this space has been sort of in the backdrop of my cv for the last five or six years. Yeah. Uh, you know, this has a treatment to the impaired. Yeah, other than prescription medication has become very interesting and intriguing to me. And you kind of jumped in with both feet, both feet jumped in both feet. So, uh, I, I'm, I'm feeling that you're a little bit of an educator.

Speaker 1: What were you teaching at? Fairly Dickinson Center. I taught finance, financial, sport management. All right, so sports management, we get finance. So you got a brain in there, got a little bit, you know, what you're talking about. So your, your finances all about connecting the dots, that's it. And you started to connect the dots here on concussions and pain management and all this. That's right. You know, do you jump in both feet with a, with everything or why was this different? Well, it was different because it was personally now and I took it personal and I took it personal because I didn't get my 40 acres and a mule when I left the national football league. You know, unlike some of these young punks today that all these programs are in place for the pre 1998 guys, they didn't get that. Have you ever retired before 1998? You're caught between a rock and a hard place in terms of the benefits of the increase in benefits that these players have gotten of late.

Speaker 1: You know, the Johnny come lately, lately as I call them. Yeah. So that. So there is kind of like a before and after. Oh no doubt. So 98 is the, is the stake in the ground kind of thing? Pretty much. Totally different story, totally different story. You get, you know, five years of continuing education now, three years of benefits when you leave the national football league. Now a annuitized funds up to a million dollars. Okay. Um, once you become vested, uh, there's all sorts of programs now wholesale. Oh, wholesale, different, whole different ballgame now, you know, whereas, you know, my guys are fighting for a better pension by guys are fighting for longterm care, longterm acute care. Right. How do you make that? Let me make a term acute care. Right? You know, um, say I become unstable and I have to go into nursing home and I'm getting social security and I'm getting a pension from the national football league.

Speaker 1: It's not enough. God's not enough. What if I'm a doesn't service this dripping drooling guy who's drooling from his mouth and I'm shaking and I have tremors all day long and I have children behind me that are looking for, you know, some sort of assistance from their father and I blew all my money, uh, trying to sort out my injuries and have all these surgeries along the way. What happens? What really happens to me now that the cheering has truly stopped and the milk right there, there's, that's right. So, so the pre 98 guys, you know, what are you guys, how are you banding together? How do you discuss this? How will you know this is seems like a, a crime if the buying right now that we got buy in right now, you have a magnitude of players that no longer represent the shield on the field, but they represent the shield on the daily walks of lives.

Speaker 1: They want to change the landscape and the culture of the way the public thinks of the professional athlete. Not every player retires with the trophy wife, with the trophy life and the trophy child. It just don't do. It doesn't happen. The 80 slash 20 rule applies the national football league. Just like any other business. Eighty percent do the work. Twenty percent make most of the money. Got It, right? Yeah. It applies so well. You thought that one out of five and your locker room was that successful? They're not maybe maybe 10 percent of that locker room. Is that successful? Maybe another 20 percent is quasi as successful and maybe 30 percent or Kinda just there floating while the other 40 percent or that done no. Good. They're done. Done. So what are you doing now to call attention to it? Is there a website that I can send people?

Speaker 1: There's brand unity. Trust. There we go. So now it didn't just take us through exactly what you're doing with brain grand unity, trust. It educates it eradicates and it supports families. Families that have someone within the family who has been injured, maimed, or is dealing with some form of traumatic brain injury and the cognitive impairment which is caused from it. Is this limited to football? No, not at all. No cheerleaders. Recreational users and athletes and athletes in general. So if you play basketball, football, baseball, hockey, last night a baseball player got hit in the head with a baseball last night. I guarantee you, Tbi has now set in. Okay. Um, I mean a lot of cheerleaders who fallen? Oh really? I mean a lot of rugby players. I mean, a lot of the lacrosse players had been hitting their head by ball. I mean, uh, I mean people from all four forms and walks of life who have witnessed some form of traumatic brain injury and that are now trying to deal with it.

Speaker 1: PTSD. Yeah. Okay. Now, how many, uh, how many guys that you know, pre 98 do you think suffer from Ptsd because of football? Oh, there's many per percentage wise. Um, well I couldn't tap into that, but I can tell you there's a, there's a bunch, there's a bunch. And I'll tell you why. One of the biggest things that happened to you when you leave pro football set, you live in a game plan. You live in a playbook with an itinerary in the game, but you don't get a handbook to tell you how to live your life. You get a swift kick in the ass. They said, good luck. I hope you have a great life. And Oh, by the way, you're no longer number 70. Yo. That guy again, he Leonard Leonard has been so he didn't anymore. So that's reality. And that's an interesting to ask you because your, your and, and I, I think maybe we should talk about bill parcells a little bit.

Speaker 1: Your, your, every moment was dictated, you know? Yeah. Okay. You can go home now. You better be back by x time. And this is exactly what we're going to do every day for the whole season. Not only that, it told you what to eat, what time they eat it. Yeah. Um, how often they eat, how often the drinking. Yeah. You had to weigh in every week. Weigh in every week can cost you money. If you're overweight, don't want to do that. Right, so this just. It's just a different lifestyle. It's a lifestyle that you developed as an athlete. You were a kid if you played sports. That's why I tell people I don't hate football. Football shaped my life. Football has shaped the lives of athletics, has shaped the lives of many men and women who are successful. I'd be willing to interview Bill Gates to find out just exactly how much sports played in his life and the discipline said that he's had in his life being that he didn't have a college education, which a lot of people don't know the young people.

Speaker 1: Yeah. That's structures there that, that, that structured, that commitment, that time commitment, that willing to win to excel, to be driven to. To finish. Not just start but finish. It's almost like an athlete. Don't just start to play. Play the play in Finnish. Sounds like you might've given that advice when you were a teaching school a little bit. Quite often you teach, teach, teach, teach that. Now, does that come from your folks? Does that come from bill? What? Where's that cut? They could comes from, from, from the various people who have touched my life over the years. You know, you, you just don't by fluke, uh, become successful in athletics. Well, what were your folks like? My, my parents are hard working people. My mother was a housewife. She, uh, she had a modest job part time, but she raised seven children. My Dad, my dad had three, three jobs.

Speaker 1: So he worked three jobs. He worked, he worked two jobs and owned the bar. Okay. So, so for third income, so, you know, and he owned the bar and he was no dummy know no dumb either. He owned the bar. So, so yeah. So I mean, um, so that's work ethic from both of them because all they're doing is working discipline. There we go. Right. So then, uh, how, how well did you play and how easy was it to play when you were in, when you were at Lsu? Lsu, how easy was that structured to just strap onto your shoulders? Lsu was phenomenal. Lsu. But I had planned fellas. You had the high schools have it, right? I mean, I was recruited by every major school that that's you. You're going. Yeah, I do. But I knew that I wanted to play on TV. I knew that I wanted to play in the state of Louisiana.

Speaker 1: I knew that I wanted my parents to be able to watch me do it and I knew that I was going to do everything in my power to get the national football league and, and it just so happened that I finished the test, you know, it doesn't sound like it just so happened. No, you just explained how you started and you and I finished and I finished it and that's what I'm teaching, you know, um, to, to people to people. So, so you had the structure at Lsu and uh, just let's just talk about coaching a little bit in, in the nfl and what you took away from it. What, uh, what positives there were and maybe what negatives are, what? I think the negative, I'll touch on a negative piece of it. The negative piece of the coaching and the national football league is using negative reinforcement to create a positive by telling a guy he can't do something as often as, as, as, as some coaches would, uh, doesn't speak to the positive structure with the national football league represents. Um, I think by having the guy who was a good teacher, who's educated, who is a systems type guy, and not just a plug and play guy, but who can systematically articulate a message and then show you how to get from point a to point d, uh, with measure.

Speaker 1: I think, um, uh, like a bill bellacheck or bill parcells or Jerry stovall or Pete Jenkins, which were men that touched my life along the way, I think speaks volume to success in sports. So, so, uh, focusing on success in life. Totally understood. So focusing on, on the bills because you bring them up and I think that, uh, for folks that aren't in the NFL, they probably don't know that there isn't negative reinforcement there and there is a complete and total plan. So no doubt believable with Bella check, right? Because believable, right? Believable. And, and, and, and, and evidenced in all of his work ethic and uh, and um, you know, a man who was a dignified, unified and um, who totally create a connection with his players, how to do that by buying into it and by getting the planet, by into it and believe in everything that he told them, being all about it, just being all about it.

Speaker 1: I mean, and I think that that's what makes Tom Brady who he is today and that's what make them one hell of a team and a. that's awesome. Besides the cheating. Yeah. Yeah, I know. And, and I think that's why you will end up seeing that, uh, they may end up having to rename that award, the check award already thinking. Oh no doubt. No doubt. Well, we got a problem though. You got a nice tie on. You look great. This guy, this guy can't. He's always wearing sweatshirts. He came naming an award guy wearing a sweatshirt. That's him. He's the Bond Jovia coach. Alright, let's just do this while we're here. All right. Take us through the superbowl year. It's a special year. Is a big year. Did you guys know and in camp that it was going to happen? Which one? The first one. Oh, no doubt. No doubt.

Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean we got our butts kicked by Chicago last year, the year before, the year before. But I can tell you the superbowl was one in that locker room after that game as we knew. Oh yeah. After that game, we got our ass kicked that bad that we knew that we didn't want to feel that way again. And then no matter who it was that we played against the next season, they would know it was over. I was over. It was open before you even started. Who, who, who was, uh, a specific voice after that specific loss. I think every guy on the defensive side of the football we got. Oh, I think every guy on that side of the ball from, from Carson, the tail of the banks to myself. Two reasons to, you know, you name it, your name and the names. That was a good deal. I mean, every guy, every guy. Because remember now, Keppra, Johnson, Eric Dorsey, Mark Collins, those guys weren't part of the team. Yeah, not yet. Those guys weren't there yet. Those guys were drafted in 86 and joined the team. But the guys that won 85 giants that got their ass whooped and Chicago, believe me. That was the motivating. There we go. And motivating for you brought up the other one that was a whole different thing because sims goes down and the whole bit. Right. That was that surprising to you guys? Or did you also know you had that one?

Speaker 1: We knew we could win it with a guy like Jeff. Jeff Foster. Yeah. We knew when it would have gotten icon Stella, but we didn't think that, uh, we didn't think that it would come down to that. What made it come down to that was the fact that, uh, we lost to San Francisco on the Monday night game seven three on that park. Yep. But that night, one of our former teammates, Jim Birth Kinda was given it to his teammates back on the east coast at 64 by and um, so the, it took a little person I see to go knock on doors. We're not going to take that. Nope. Took a little personal and uh, and then it just showed up. Yeah. Well you met them again in the, in, in the championship game. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Everybody back. I like to call it the body bag game.

Speaker 1: Everybody thought you guys were losing that weight. We like to call it the body bag because we, uh, we left a couple of their guys in body bags though. How's Jimmy? Because it's still keep in touch with. He's all right. I see him all the time. Great Guy. All right, so we got three final questions for you. I'll tell you what they are and then I'll ask you them in order. First question is, what has most surprised you in cannabis? Second question is, what has most surprised you in life? And the third question is on the soundtrack of lender Marshall's. Like what is one track, one song that's got to be on there? We'll do that last. We already talked about music a little bit, so that'll be easy for you. I think. What is most surprised you about cannabis? What surprised me the most about cannabis is um, the multiple applications in use usage that cannabis has a in terms of health care or, or, or alternative medicine. So now you, you talked about this as a personal thing, now you have felt these benefits yourself. Oh no doubt. Felt these benefits myself. Yeah. Um, how, so? I have presently used CBD. You do? Yes, I do. Okay. What does it help? It helps with headaches. Yup. It helps with tremors. It helps with my ability to sleep peacefully at night.

Speaker 1: It helps with depression. It can definitely help with seizures if it helps me with tremors. Yeah. Um, now it's CBD, so it's, it's not a really psychoactive does make you foggy though or no? No, it doesn't make you foggy. That's the thing. It doesn't make you foggy and it has no thc in it. Right. Okay. So, all right, so let's make you can make it clear here. Absolutely. No, there's, there's no thc involved. Uh, um, if you want that, you can have that, which, what, you know, it's a different thing. Teaches only a different thing. Yeah. But uh, but um, the products that I've used and they've helped me, they've all been above board and some of the greatest stuff that's out there. There you go. What has most surprised you in life? Um, the disconnect associated with the national football league. How do you mean?

Speaker 1: After, after, after spending the time that I spent, I'm in the game, the, the disconnect, the benefits, a post career that I felt should have been, should have been better. They weren't there for you and, and they just weren't there for, for, for players like they should be. Yeah. So that [inaudible] 98 thing, I mean that I can see that it firstly, it hurts imperative. It's imperative and it hurts you. Yeah. Well, I mean, you know, listen, we played the most violent sport there is known to man for money. Okay. We'll play a kids game for king's ransom. But only so many ended up kings. Yeah. So longterm acute care. It's important to the game of football if it's that important to play as shouldn't be that important to the owners. That's it. Okay. And it's not, or it hasn't been. Maybe it will. Maybe the times will change that, but it hasn't been. What was it like working on that movie? Concussion. It was fun. Yeah. Fun work with some quality people. What do you think came out of that? Uh, I think a lot of good. A lot of information. I think the public is more aware now of what really happened with some of the larger these players and uh, and how they were treated and how things were dealt with. I know at the, uh,

Speaker 1: media level and a guys that cover the sport, I know they are more informed. Not that they weren't before. A lot of them had this information to begin with. It just didn't want to believe it. And a lot of those that had the information were very pissed off. So pissed off why he pissed off, pissed, upset because it got to this point I didn't have to get to this point. I gotcha. That's interesting. Alright, so a final question. One Song, one track that's got to be on the soundtrack of your life.

Speaker 3: Uh, uh,

Speaker 1: one song, one meters. By the way, do you want a junior and the voice? Yeah. One Song or one? Yeah. One Song in one track. That's got to be on the soundtrack of my life. Wow. This is a good one.

Speaker 3: Great.

Speaker 1: James Brown. Get on. Get on up. All right, let's get into it. Get involved. That's it. That's it. A superbowl champ. Leonard Marshall. Thank you so much. Alright. Alright, you got it. All right.

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Speaker 3: imaginable was excellent. Absolutely. First question we got asked, you know, I, I, uh, went on ancestry.com. I look back and I look back, no,

Speaker 4: no relation to Andy Williams and the family. How did you guys meet? How'd you come in contact? Was a freshman at Indiana and arcview investor conference in Portland and um, I was there, you know, a big football player was there and what was announced in a meeting. I met a lot people and you know, for me I'm the kind of person I tend to gravitate toward, gravitate towards people that I, that I feel like I have things in common with. And uh, I started, you're drawn to Liz and Liz know, made the connection and uh, it just felt like kindred spirits. Know what, what is it about him that makes him a kindred spirit for you? Well, the first thing that drew my attention was it was a medicine man, you know, and I consider myself a medicine man. And so I was, I was immediately drawn to, to the name and no, just his, his lightheartedness, you, he has an open heart and he's kind any successful, you know, I think to me as a, as an athlete, as a football player, I always wanted to be really good at what I did, but I always wanted to be a good person also in, uh, you know, not take things too seriously and just be fun to be around.

Speaker 4: And I think, you know, to me that's the essence of life is as you do good work and you and you spread joy while doing. That's beautifully said. That gives me a opportunity to talk about Rick laureate. Yes. Why, why that a pen name, if you will know? I'm uh, I'm trying to recreate history and created magic back back of my freshman year at Texas. Um, 19, 95. I get to Texas were sitting down before the school year starts in, our advisor says we have to get an email address. And at the time I was like, what's email you? I was thinking I couldn't think of a name. And so I said what the heck and my email address my freshman year at Texas was heisman at [inaudible] Dot Edu and four years later I ended up winning the heisman trophy. And so my next big goal is to, is to win a Nobel peace prize.

Speaker 4: And so I figure if I have a twitter handle with, with laureate, you know, then maybe it'll inspire me to do something to change the world. I love that man. That is, I like the goal setting and uh, the fact that it already has worked. Yes, yes. We got to talk about a Texas playing football in Texas. Peanut people take football a little bit seriously, Texas, they sure do. And um, it works to my favor, you know, I feel like because I, I went to tech because it had so much success, you know, I'm a mortar lies to a certain extent. I have a statue on the campus of University of Texas and it seems like I can get away with doing things that other people can't get away with doing. So I'll take it when I just want to track this for a minute. When did you realize personally internally that winning the heisman trophy was even in the carts? My, my junior year, the first year I started at as a tailback. I played fullback in my first two years and um,

Speaker 4: I just had a couple of really big games and ended up looking like I was leading. I was leading the nation in rushing and you know, being the best usually associated with the heisman trophy and so kind of got a taste of it. I finished fifth in the voting. It wasn't invited to New York and the next year I was thinking about, you know, do I go to the NFL, do I, do I stay in college? And I was flipping through a ncaa all neck and I looked at the record for most yards rushing yard to the history of the NCAA. And I was like, wow, you know, I'm not that far away. If I have the same year I had last year, you know, I could, I could break this. And I was like, all right, flip through it and saw the touchdowns and I was like, kind of the same year I had last year, I can break this.

Speaker 4: And I said what the heck? And I went to all purpose yards and I looked and I said, hey, if I stay and have a decent year like I had last year and then I can break this. And so I was inspired to do something special to have a goal to reach. And uh, I figured if I break the all time rushing record and the time touchdown, right, because time, all purpose yards, they got to give me the heisman. And so I went forward and I got it. I, I have a sense, I'm not an athlete. I've sensed that you kind of just page in rule book and realizing that you could break history. Yes. Yeah. Just kind of coming to you, you know, to me it's such a rare situation that's rare, you know, that I was able to start for three years and compile enough yardage, earshot, that I had a chance for me, I looked at it.

Speaker 4: I was like, wow, these opportunities don't come along very often. I got to seize the moment and at least I got to go for it. You know, I got to see if I can do it. So you do win the heisman. You're drafted. Very high, very interesting draft. Talk about what happened from your perspective. Yeah, so, so going into the draft, you know, my thing was I broke down, I broke all these records, I showed everyone that I'm the best player in the country and the world I should be the number one overall pick. And that year there was a lot of talk about quarterbacks. There's tim couch, there was a download, mcnabb, keely Smith, cage mcmahon, Dante coal, pepper, a lot of quarterbacks. And so, you know, the talk was I might slide down and be the number four be the first running back taken and you know, I was paying someone to be the number on number one overall pick plus go into Cleveland.

Speaker 4: And they were an expansion team coming back and you know, it's a traditional football, rough city and I wouldn't, I just know do well in that environment. You know, it just fit my personality, so draft day comes and I'm not the first pick, second pick, third pick, and then the culture picking fourth. And I'm thinking, okay, I'm going to go to the colts. And they ended up drafting Andrew and James. So then I was like, Damn, oh, the theme of the first running back. And then consolation prize was Mike Ditka traded, you know, the whole draft and the first pick from, for the next year's draft in order to draft me. So he did trade the whole draft. He did. He did. What were you thinking at the time? I was thinking like it was better. It was crazy.

Speaker 4: I was thinking it was crazy. I'm enough. I was still swirling from not being drafted until the fifth overall pick until Kinda was a lot of information at one time I just said I'm just going to go with it and just, you know, my name is, let's just make this, make the best of this reports have at that, uh, didn't really work out and a new orleans. But uh, what about you and Mike Ditka? How, what, you know, what was, did you take anything from that relationship? I loved it. I mean, I learned a lot about life, a lot about going through difficulty. Um, I have a lot of respect for him. Um, true player's coach really understood the game of football and I think he made me a better football player. You talked about the Brahms, you and I talked about Jim Brown for that's, that's an inspirational figure.

Speaker 4: Get into, uh, how you came to know Jim Brown as a person and then how you came to know the person. Jim Brown. Yeah. So, so Jim, growing up, you know, I'd hear stories about Jim Brown and, you know, do a little research back then before Google, you know, I had to go to the library and look in the encyclopedia. And really what stood out to me was, you know, he was um, he's associated with the civil rights movement know, and the idea that a famous athlete had something to do with creating change. Now as a kid, you hear about Martin Luther King and you hear about civil rights movement and you hear about these, these people that are creating powerful change in the world. So to me the archetype of the, of the athlete is always connected to using that to create a change in the world. And so when I finally became a professional football player, I wanted to meet Jim and you know, now that I was following in his footsteps, you know, I'm, I was, I knew that he had knowledge to impart until synchronicity has it.

Speaker 4: Sports illustrated was doing a cover and they wanted to do legends from the past and the new newcomers. So the photo shoot with me and Jim Brown on the cover of sports illustrated and for the photos inside of the inside of the magazine. We went to his house and we did a really cool photo shoot. There's a cool shot with both of us standing up next to each other on top of the pool. And we have surf boards were totally a surf board like this. We have shorts on, but it looks like we're naked. Is a cool picture and a picture of us in the pool together and just being around him and really feeling his spirit. If someone who was a very intelligent person, someone who has done so many different things, who like me, understood that football's not everything, that you can take that platform and do other things. And you know, he had a, uh, an amazing acting career, amazing stories he tells and just, he's such a worldly person, you know, it's like I want, when I'm his age, when I'm older, you know, I want to embody that same thing that I've, that I've lived in, that I've done something significant that I've left something bigger. Mark, that just what I did on the football field.

Speaker 5: He had a bunch of good years in Miami. Um, which is, yeah, what you're talking about did happen. Meaning there was a, a, a pronounced moment in time and it kind of was there the whole time. But where it was like, rick, he's doing something that no one understands. Yeah. So from your perspective, what was happening?

Speaker 4: Well, I didn't understand what I was doing. How'd you understand what I was doing? Either a, I just was in a point where I had a taste that there was more to life than what I was experiencing in. And ultimately that tastes, you know, became too tempting and I had to go for it.

Speaker 5: I understand the positive action of moving forward. Leaving a lot behind. Yeah. How, how were you able to reckon with that?

Speaker 4: Uh, it was, I guess I'm lucky in my life when I have these, these crossroads are these tough choices. Um, I get really. I guess I get really lucky because it just seemed so obvious to me what, what to do. So because an APP is authentically, organically, you know. And so for instance, I was in a car with a friend and we were driving from New York to Miami and uh, and I had known this woman for maybe a year and she'd always introduce yourself as an actress. I'm an actress. And so we were talking and she said, you know, asked you, I like appended down. I said, so, you know, what have you done acting? She says, I was in a play for years ago and that was it. And I was like, but, you know, but you always introduce yourself as an actress. And so I started asking myself like, what am I, am I still something that I was, that I was a long time ago?

Speaker 4: And so I asked myself, am I still a football player who really wants to be the best? And when I got with no, there's other things that I'm interested in that are, that are more important to me. And it was shocking. It was shocking, uh, awareness and it kind of jarred me. And then I first thought was, okay, like, what about what about my house and my car and went about all my stuff and I was like, does it mean anything to me? And I was like, wow, I thought what about my team and a reputation? And I was like, well, I'm ready to do something else. And so it was a, it was a feeling that I couldn't deny. I tried to deny it, but I couldn't. And uh, eventually I had to follow it.

Speaker 5: Uh, so that, uh, takes strength, it takes,

Speaker 4: yeah, yeah, you know, but I loved the adventure of life. I remember when I called, I called up the NFL and told them that I was done. I saw my whole life flashed before my eyes and I realized, you know, up to that point who I was, my identity was so much wrapped and being a professional football player that it was, it was almost like a death, you know, and I remember walking away from the game and I felt this huge weight lifted off my shoulders and I felt this freedom to be, to be whatever I wanted it to be and I was fortunate enough to, to have a year off to find myself and get a sense of who I was and then come back to play football and NBA. Able to, to prepare my reputation and to finish my career strong. And also to integrate two different parts of myself and to create a future where I have something to offer the community.

Speaker 5: Those years back after the year off, a teammates, coaches you. What was the interaction and understanding of you as you as more of a total person?

Speaker 4: Yeah. What will ultimately, I think when you do something that people don't understand, they put you in the. We can't understand him. He's crazy. And to me it's a gift because then they don't try to understand you and then they just say, oh, that's just ricky. And so when I came back, I was a good teammate. I busted my ass. I worked hard and everything else was. That's just, that's just until into. I felt like I came back, I had the freedom to be myself, and it was, it was great.

Speaker 5: They cared about you overperform and the rest which matter to you. They're like, oh, it's ricky and ricky.

Speaker 4: Exactly, exactly. And I mean, I think that's the value of being good at what you do is people give you freedom to be yourself,

Speaker 5: which brings us back kind of to cannabis. Yes. Notice, uh, andy is good at what he does. Um, this seems to be an area that you're interested in as far as business, as far as you know, lifestyle. What are you thinking? What are you doing to me,

Speaker 4: there's a overlap between business and lifestyle, mean the. And I think I'm in a unique position where my lifestyle is my business. You know, I'm at an investor conference and it's interesting because I'm seeing, you know, all these people who have expertise in the field and they're bringing into the cannabis industry and offering that expertise to the community. And I look at myself and I say, okay, what expertise do I have? And I was like, okay, well I was a football player. I'm like, all right, well no, what is that? And I say, okay, I have some expertise, I have, I've developed some kind of fame. And so, you know, I can get awareness, you know, I can, I can create a tension. And then I think, you know, I spent a lot of time working on my spiritual, my spiritual life. And so I have wisdom that as an, as an asset.

Speaker 4: And so for me it's about looking for creative ways to be a part of the community and cannabis and something that has been a big part of my life. And it, you know, there's overlap with my curiosity, my, my, my interest in my experience is when I use, when I use cannabis questions of like, what's going on, my natural curiosity about human nature and, and, you know, the way I look at it, cannabis gives you access to your things that tend to be unconscious. They give you access to the more subjective side of yourself. And that's where I live. And uh, you know, I love depth psychology, so it's really a convergence of a lot of things I'm interested in and I'm learning. I'm really here to be educated and I know as I, as I create more relationships and talk to people, my ideas will develop. Um, you know, I'll germinate other people's seed ideas and ingest something will grow out of it. I really believe in and finding, you know, like soulmates and all that we do. People wherever we have a connection and where no matter what's going on on the outside from our hearts, we're moving in the same direction. And I feel that that's how you get things done.

Speaker 5: That's beautifully said. And again, starting to understand how we're going to get to rick, the laureate, uh, you spoke about cannabis, you spoke about the plant in, in a, a really specific way. Can you share more about your experience with cannabis and what it's opened up for you? What it's informed, how it's important to you?

Speaker 4: Yeah. Um, all right. So now I'm going to show off my pseudo dorkiness. Okay. So, you know, I'm very curious person. I consider myself a very philosophical person and I love to learn. And so one of the paradigms I use to, to interact or interface with the, with the world is astrology. Okay. And so astrology essentially, it's not what you see in magazines or newspapers. It's, it's really a language. All right? And so, so the idea and astrology, the planet Neptune or the sign Pisces. Okay. It's about self transcendence, you know, and, and with typical, when you read books about Pisces or people with strong enough to, they tend to. It's the archetype of the mistake. The shadow side is they tend to go towards addiction. You know, it's, it's, it's usually because their psychic sensitivity, they're so sensitive to everything around them, it's overwhelming and they have to do something to numb it because they can't deal with it.

Speaker 4: And so, um, cannabis to me is resonant with that, with that energy, you know, when it's, when it's used properly, it allows you to let go of the little things that you can, you can't let go that you hold onto that blind you and it gives you access to, to a wider range of, of information. Um, and so I think sometimes when you have it in this world, this world, it's like they've, they've pulled all the magic out of this world. Everything is so, you know, materialistic and it's all about science. It's like the Narnia movies where the trees don't talk and everything's dead. It's like, you know, the magic has been sucked out of life. And I think at this point in time, cannabis is a tool that helps us connect back to the magic of life. And I think that adds, that adds meaning and it has joined and it's connection.

Speaker 4: And I think if the world had more of that, you know, the world would be a better place. And I also acknowledged that the shadow side, if you're not given the tools or you don't know how to deal with the subjective side, then it'll lead to addiction and problems. But I think if we have an honest conversation and look at, you know, what are we getting from this planet, how can we maximize, you know, what it has to offer. I think it's, I think it's a, it's a good time for that in the world. Could really use it. Absolutely. And I think when, when you speak about both sides with magic and subjectivity, uh, that's why I prefer as far as cannabis, uh, to, to be with others. Yes, yes. Yeah, it's an experience. I mean, you know, it's interesting. I think it's a social thing where when you're really connected to your feelings and you're around people that you trust, you know, I think there's a deeper connection that, that can occur. Um, and at the same time, if you're around people that you don't trust, there can be a deeper wounding. No, because because you are so, so sensitive back into the show. Yeah. Back into the show. Exactly. Deeper into the shadow. Yeah, exactly. Uh, this is pretty great. I could do this all day. I couldn't do, I love it. Now, you know, we, we spoke to a couple of a former NFL players who've played more recently than you who brought up the fact that, you know,

Speaker 4: medicating with cannabis for pain management specifically with something that does, does, did happen with them. What about with you and just generally, you know, the medicinal attributes of capitals? No, that's an interesting question. I'm not comfortable with saying that I, that I used it for pain in the, in the conventional way that people would think about it,

Speaker 3: um,

Speaker 4: in an unconventional way. I would say that's what it does. So I'll explain. So from a spiritual sense, um, you know, pain is when we're overly attached to something, right? Because really what people experience is painted a lot of times just intensity. But if you're holding onto something that you translated is paint. And so, you know, I come home after work and I'm stressed about, I didn't have a good practice coach bug the bug mattamy and I need this many yards, you know, and I go and I spoke and I let all that go. Right, okay. What's important, you know, get on the ground, stretch a little bit, take some deep breaths, you know, go watch a little bit of film, know, and I wake up in the morning energized and ready to go to work, not drained and worried, you know, and like just creating that as a lifestyle, it allowed me to, to improve and get better and allow me to recover faster from injuries. Um, it allowed me to play better, so I found a way to use it that, that worked for me in enhanced my life.

Speaker 5: Does it blow your mind because we're about the same age and I feel like we came to cannabis the same type of way. Does it blow your mind what people were saying about, um, you know, little page, a little Charlotte Figgy, Charlotte's web, a note, no seizures as far as epilepsy. Uh, you know, kind of solving problems with Crohn's and colitis and helping with coming off of a chemotherapy treatments, just kind of cannabis as medicine. What are you thinking?

Speaker 4: I mean it's, it's mind blowing, you know, because I think people that have that have a fairly decent relationship with cannabis if it's because they've experienced positive effects and I think it's science starts to enter more and more research is done. I think it's, it's fascinating. It's really amazing times. Some of the interesting thing about life, you know, it's rare that we discover a new species of animal or a new plan or new new medicine and cannabis has been around for so long, but because of prohibition and something that really hasn't been explored and so as it's, it's becoming more acceptable and it's coming to the light, it's really opening up a whole new world that's going to change. It's going to change everything. And to me that's what's, that's what blows my mind. I mean, it's, it's mind blowing

Speaker 5: the, the, the implicit power of what is about to become, you know, and it's, it's one of those things that because the energy of cannabis, it's magical and it tells me that you can't be, you can't predict. I got three final questions. I'll tell you what they are and then I'll ask you them in order. You might have already answered the first two, but I'll ask anyway. So what has most surprised you in cannabis? First question. What has most surprised you in life? Second question. Yeah. Then on the soundtrack of Ricky Williams life one track, one song that's going to have you answered, what has most surprised you in cannabis?

Speaker 3: I haven't, I haven't.

Speaker 4: What has most surprised me in cannabis is

Speaker 4: I was afraid that as I took a more public stance that there would be pushed back or that I experienced some kind of negativity around it. To date, I haven't knock, knock on wood, I haven't experienced any pushback. If anything people are, they seem excited to be able to have a conversation about it. You know, they seem, they seem more curious than 10 prohibitive and it's, that's, that's been, uh, that's, that's blowing my mind and also on the, on the other side of that, and it shouldn't surprise me is how many, the amount of people that use cannabis that pretend not to use cannabis, and I was one of them, I was one of them a long time. So I, I mean I'm not, I'm not trying to be judgmental, but it's, it's the, the, the um, the amount is really mind blowing and it's alarming and even more alarming is if half of them know, it would just come to terms with it.

Speaker 4: They'd realize one that people don't care and to how things change where they wouldn't have to hide it. Almost the solution is in the problem. Exactly, exactly. What has most surprised you in life? Um, how stupid people are. Not including myself, you know, I think growing up or she say including myself, of course. Yes. Well, you know, growing up I always had an assumption that people were, were trustworthy or people had, people were competent, you know, just watching television, it seemed like, okay, things get done and becoming an adult, realizing that there's a human being underneath underneath that mask, you know, you know, that's my Pollyanna, that's my naivete, but that, that's, that's been the most surprising thing that, uh, at the end of the day, human beings are simply human beings, unfortunately. Yes. Yes. Alright, so the biggest question on the soundtrack of Ricky Williams life, one track one song. That's got to be easy. Bob Marley. Wake up. Come on now. Yeah, yeah, I got to hug it. Yeah, of course. That's good. That's good stuff.

Speaker 2: And there you have Leonard Marshall and Ricky Williams. Very much appreciated lenders time. Very much appreciated Ricky's time. Really great conversations about the fact that a cannabis is medicine and that's that. So I really hope you enjoyed those two interviews. I very much enjoy you listening to this. Thank you so much for your time.

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Cannabis Economy is a real-time history of legal cannabis. We chronicle how personal and industry histories have combined to provide our current reality.