fbpx

Ep.254: Jmichaele Keller, Steep Hill Labs

Cannabis Economy Podcast
Ep.254: Jmichaele Keller, Steep Hill Labs

Ep.254: Jmichaele Keller, Steep Hill Labs

Jmichaele Keller joins us and shares that he considered himself a global citizen upon his first trip out of the states when he was a kid. He appreciated architecture, went to Rome and as far as Asia to investigate. He found a calling though in computers- in which he started before there were Windows. He got a job as a room service waiter and fell in love with hospitality. He got one of the first IBM PCs that Marriott had- which had 64K of RAM and a 10 Megabyte hard drive. He made his way into finance and wowed executives by budgeting and forecasting using that now archaic machine. From there he went on to software and on to real estate. Jmichaele ultimately found his way into the cannabis industry through the very important work of lab testing.

Transcript:

Speaker 1: JMichaele Keller, JMichaele Keller joins us and shares that he considered himself a global citizen upon his first trip out of the states when he was a kid, he appreciated architecture, went to Roman as far as Asia to investigate it. Came back to the states and got an early job as a room service waiter and fell in love with hospitality. He found a calling though in computers when he got one of the first ibm pcs that Marriott had. He made his way into finance and wowed executives by budgeting and forecasting using that now archaic machine. From there, he went onto software and onto real estate, and Jamie shall ultimately found his way into the cannabis industry through the very important work of lab testing and on the side, he now works on consciousness. Welcome to cannabis economy. On your host Seth Adler, check us out on social with the American economy. That's two ends in the word economy from steep hill labs jam, Michelle Keller. Excellent. Perfect. Perfect.

Speaker 2: I have to admit to you that every time we've now seen each other many, many times all over the world. Yeah. And every time I faked my way into, you know, being able to pronounce your name, I have. Just tell me, think French. Okay. That's the key. Jay. Michelle [inaudible]. Michelle, doesn't that sound so exotic? Does, and this is not what I thought it was to begin with. And by the way, there are many people in the industry who have no idea that that's how to pronounce it. You realize that, right? So Jamie Shall Keller, which is easier. Yeah. Uh, yeah, that's the German side of me. But you, I know that you're based in Amsterdam and you just don't sound Dutch. I was born in Ohio. [inaudible]. So let's just start there. Okay. We'll get to steep hill, right? Because that's why you're here. Let's be honest. But, uh, why are, and there Sara Bader be look at that.

Speaker 2: Um, why? Uh, Ohio to Amsterdam in cannabis. You know, what was it like growing up in Ohio? Where in Ohio? Sandusky. Okay. So like literally like the Midwest and Midwest, obviously someplace that I would not be comfortable in. And did you know that how, how immediately in your life did you know that? As soon as I went to college, I'm like, all right, I'm never going back. Okay, I'm going to go back because my family's there, but I could never live there. So you didn't know that you weren't really pleased with the place until you had seen something else. Is that fair? I went, I spent my junior year in Rome to school and that pretty much shifted my view point to like, all right, I was accidentally born in the u. s got it. That's my viewpoint. And so, uh, what's university were you at to Notre Dame?

Speaker 2: Notre Dame. Other midwestern Catholic. Exactly. Catholic boy. Sixteen years of Catholic education. And you're a big fan of Newt rockne and absolutely live and die. It was a sports guy, so I know who knew him. But you do know, you have to know because it's a, it's a, it's a religion actually their football. That's why they have the gold dome. When you had touched on Jesus, you know about that too, right? Of course. These things actually there are tests. Well, are you a religious person because you went to Rome? My religion and architecture. Okay. Aha. Aha. So you have old stuff. Have old style. Old African would say that. So you get to Rome and then just as you do your, does your mind's eye opened up completely and. Totally. Oh my God. Um, well it probably opened a little bit earlier than that because I traveled a lot as a kid with my parents and it probably happened when I was twelfth.

Speaker 2: Okay. Um, we spent three months in the Orient and I was fundamentally changed already then. So I don't really, I've kind of been a world citizen since I was twice as long as I can remember. So what, what did you see and feel in these other places? You know, what, what was it that, that kind of Roman, the Asia, this was not similar, but no, they are similar in that they are not America. Definitely not American. It's like when I can give you the example of why I chose to move to Holland. Okay. So I mean it was for a business reason. I'm like, we needed an office in, in the EU somewhere. Um, and at the time I was living in a motor coach. Okay. I'm with my girlfriend. I'm drifting around the United States where we felt like dean because I was running a software company and all I need is an internet connection.

Speaker 1: JMichaele Keller, JMichaele Keller joins us and shares that he considered himself a global citizen upon his first trip out of the states when he was a kid, he appreciated architecture, went to Roman as far as Asia to investigate it. Came back to the states and got an early job as a room service waiter and fell in love with hospitality. He found a calling though in computers when he got one of the first ibm pcs that Marriott had. He made his way into finance and wowed executives by budgeting and forecasting using that now archaic machine. From there, he went onto software and onto real estate, and Jamie shall ultimately found his way into the cannabis industry through the very important work of lab testing and on the side, he now works on consciousness. Welcome to cannabis economy. On your host Seth Adler, check us out on social with the American economy. That's two ends in the word economy from steep hill labs jam, Michelle Keller. Excellent. Perfect. Perfect.

Speaker 2: I have to admit to you that every time we've now seen each other many, many times all over the world. Yeah. And every time I faked my way into, you know, being able to pronounce your name, I have. Just tell me, think French. Okay. That's the key. Jay. Michelle [inaudible]. Michelle, doesn't that sound so exotic? Does, and this is not what I thought it was to begin with. And by the way, there are many people in the industry who have no idea that that's how to pronounce it. You realize that, right? So Jamie Shall Keller, which is easier. Yeah. Uh, yeah, that's the German side of me. But you, I know that you're based in Amsterdam and you just don't sound Dutch. I was born in Ohio. [inaudible]. So let's just start there. Okay. We'll get to steep hill, right? Because that's why you're here. Let's be honest. But, uh, why are, and there Sara Bader be look at that.

Speaker 2: Um, why? Uh, Ohio to Amsterdam in cannabis. You know, what was it like growing up in Ohio? Where in Ohio? Sandusky. Okay. So like literally like the Midwest and Midwest, obviously someplace that I would not be comfortable in. And did you know that how, how immediately in your life did you know that? As soon as I went to college, I'm like, all right, I'm never going back. Okay, I'm going to go back because my family's there, but I could never live there. So you didn't know that you weren't really pleased with the place until you had seen something else. Is that fair? I went, I spent my junior year in Rome to school and that pretty much shifted my view point to like, all right, I was accidentally born in the u. s got it. That's my viewpoint. And so, uh, what's university were you at to Notre Dame?

Speaker 2: Notre Dame. Other midwestern Catholic. Exactly. Catholic boy. Sixteen years of Catholic education. And you're a big fan of Newt rockne and absolutely live and die. It was a sports guy, so I know who knew him. But you do know, you have to know because it's a, it's a, it's a religion actually their football. That's why they have the gold dome. When you had touched on Jesus, you know about that too, right? Of course. These things actually there are tests. Well, are you a religious person because you went to Rome? My religion and architecture. Okay. Aha. Aha. So you have old stuff. Have old style. Old African would say that. So you get to Rome and then just as you do your, does your mind's eye opened up completely and. Totally. Oh my God. Um, well it probably opened a little bit earlier than that because I traveled a lot as a kid with my parents and it probably happened when I was twelfth.

Speaker 2: Okay. Um, we spent three months in the Orient and I was fundamentally changed already then. So I don't really, I've kind of been a world citizen since I was twice as long as I can remember. So what, what did you see and feel in these other places? You know, what, what was it that, that kind of Roman, the Asia, this was not similar, but no, they are similar in that they are not America. Definitely not American. It's like when I can give you the example of why I chose to move to Holland. Okay. So I mean it was for a business reason. I'm like, we needed an office in, in the EU somewhere. Um, and at the time I was living in a motor coach. Okay. I'm with my girlfriend. I'm drifting around the United States where we felt like dean because I was running a software company and all I need is an internet connection.

Speaker 2: Sure. And a lot in those days you actually needed a cell phone but kind of use those that much anymore. But that's all I need. It's like, all right, I can run a company from anywhere. And then she said I want to settle down and I'm like, that's not in the US. And so we had some Dutch friends and they started telling me about delft, which is actually where I live or if you want to pronounce it correctly, delft a deadlift to develop. That's how you tell if somebody was actually born there. And I've got that pronunciation down down pat. So software though. So you were at Notre Dame. What were you studying at Nova texture architecture, but then how did you make your way into software? I somehow turned out to be one of the original geeks. Uh Huh. Um, so like if I look back on every job I even before, I mean, it started in computers before there was windows.

Speaker 2: Oh Wow. Really? Yeah, you look great. I mean, because that means that you're older than what you look. I'm really old. Yeah, right. Yeah. No, but before windows. That's. I mean, if you're in computing in the 19 eighties, that would mean, right? Um, yes, right. Early 80 [inaudible] time ago I went to, um, um, just while I was going to school, I went and got a job at as a room service waiter at Marriott in south bend, Indiana. Sure. And I kind of fell in love with hospitality. Um, and quick, I guess quickly thereafter I got transferred from there to Philadelphia and got one of the first ibm pcs now Marriott had. And I was hooked. It was a screamer. I had 64 K of ram and a 10 megabyte hard drive, which was amazing at the top. Yeah, because can you imagine doing budgeting for a hotel on paper?

Speaker 2: It's like, because everybody wants to change the budget all the time. Right? So it'd be iterations of paper and these huge spreadsheets and like I was like the golden boy, right. It's like you've got a computer, you can help us with our budget please. Um, and there wasn't, there was excel didn't exist and that point in time. So yeah, as far as you know, obviously the computing took you away from architecture. Why not merge the two? The computing power wasn't there to begin with. Well, oddly enough, I ended up kind of reattaching myself all the time. So everything kind of my, I guess my life has been one interlocking puzzle if you want to look at it that way. One thing has led to another and somehow served me well in the process and how, how so? So you're in Marriott and you're, you're changing, you're literally moving mountains for them.

Speaker 2: They're like, this is amazing. We can budget here by the way. You know what, the only thing that is always right, have a forecast. It's always wrong. Yeah. Well, I like kind of a little bit of a rebel if you could imagine that and at one point I told my general manager because we had to do these forecasts every month and forecast the sales. Okay. And like, which takes an enormous amount of time. Of course it's fascinating because there's definitely a ripple of that. When I, when I want to talk to an investor and they were like, give me a pro forma like, right, whatever. Other story. Okay. But it wasn't my general manager. He's like, you know, every month I'm putting together this six month for cash every month. I finally asked him like, all right, I gave you this forecast. What are you gonna do with it?

Speaker 2: What are you going to hire? Who you gonna fire winning a change because it takes me a lot of time to do this. Right. He couldn't give me an answer and I'm like, I'm done. I'm not doing any more forecast. Okay. I will forecast 30 days because we should probably do something. Yeah, we should probably know. We should probably do something 30 days out the month coming. Right. You're doing the forecast in the month for the next month because we probably should do something differently other than that I'm not doing anymore. So that's kind of, yeah, it was a bit of a rebel. What did his boss, because his boss was getting the, you know what I'm saying? The general manager. So it didn't matter. I had a great relationship with him so he kind of put up with me. Okay. Alright. So you go from that, which you're again golden boy, right?

Speaker 2: Everybody loves Ya. Um, what, what pulls you out of that? Well, a Po when w when you were done. I mean you don't do a forecasting for hotels anymore here. Alright. So. Alright. So you know, well I turned every single position I had into a software job. Got it before. So I did the first, um, this is back when Microsoft like, right. So most of the cash register you see around are actually Mike rose. I did the very first point of sale, like cash register in those days I'm almost okay hooked to a computer. I did that for Marriott as a side job. I was a, I was, wouldn't it be cool if we could do this type of thing. It's like you're right, let's, what if we hook a computer to that. Let's see what happens, you know? Um, and at the time I was, well I get transferred there to be a specialty restaurant manager and then as soon as I arrived within 48 hours, the purchasing manager quit.

Speaker 2: So like, just by happenstance, not because of you now, not because he definitely not because of me. I'm sure it was a really nice guy. I really don't know who it was, but I'm sure he was fine. And then then it's like, well wait, can I do both of those jobs? Which is I'm like, yeah, I have to be constantly challenged, not be bored because I probably would not turn out well for the world if I was born. So, so I took on both of those jobs, especially restaurant manager and also the purchasing manager. And I don't know if you've ever been like, like, know anything about pizza, but you count in a lot of shit, you know, every day it's like, how much, how many eggs do we guys don't like to do things over and over again, sir? Right. There must be a better way to kind of think of myself as a tweaker.

Speaker 2: A tweaker yeah. Like, tweak shit. It's all right. Can I make that a little bit better and easier? Uh, tech, twitter, tweaker right now the other kind of tweakers oh no, that's a different thing for another show by the way. So, so, so. Okay. So you turn every job. You had computer job to a computer job into a software job, which for there were even, there wasn't nobody programming. They were like mainframes and stuff, which is why I want to just jump and we're going to come to cannabis because I just want to jump to ai. Right. Okay. And automation. And this is happening now, right? You, I'm sure are aware that in fortune 500 companies, there are many, many processes that are being automated. Uh, you know, by not humans. Right. So first off, what do you think? Right? Isn't this your life's work anyway?

Speaker 2: You know what I like to be lost in virtual reality for extended periods of time, like Arnold Schwartzenegger. Absolutely. So I will be the first customer when they really nail it because it'd be the ultimate vacation, right? Sure. I just want to check out and be whatever I feel like being. Sure now, but that's Vr. What I'm saying is, you know, let's take the finance department and all of these, you know, kind of, uh, folks that are doing these and then you cut and paste and you do that. Instead of them doing that, let's have them actually think about bigger and better things. Absolutely. And have that whole process automated that's happening in fortune 500. Right. You know, what do you think, in other words, you were doing that in the eighties. Now they're actually now it's actually happening. What do I think? I'm,

Speaker 2: I don't know. My viewpoint would be that's all good. Okay. Okay. It'll only go so far. How do you mean? Because until, until you can achieve a level of being consciously aware, they will never be able to replace us. Okay? Yeah. All right. So there is hope for the human species. Fair enough. We have this consciousness thing, right? Another one of my passions by the way, but is what? Consciousness consciousness. The teaching people how to manage their consciousness. That's my core. Whoa. Alright, it was. Now we've got to go there. We're going to jump around here. You're that kind guy, right? And that kind of guy. So what, what, how, how can I manage my consciousness? I'm a shell in five days. Yeah. Um, you wow. It's really difficult to put this into words. It's really not translatable, but let me give you results. Fair enough.

Speaker 2: Yep. Okay. So in, and you said five days in five days. Yeah. Yeah. Teacher came up with the chorus called origins. And it is a course to teach you how to manage your consciousness to achieve what you want to achieve in your life. What would be keys to that? What would be key? What do you mean by key? So I go into the class and um, you know, I listened to you talk and then I leave and when I leave I'm thinking, okay, he said these three things, which I have to remember. Alright, forget this. All right, so these are experiences. This is not something you can learn by reading a book or listening to somebody lecture to you. I'm trying this out know, but that's why the entire world is not enlightened. Okay? Because this is not something that you can like read a book and like I have no awakened and I am aware, I am Buddha, you know, it just doesn't work that way.

Speaker 2: There's not step one, step two, step three, there really is step one, step two, step three. But nobody teaches us how to take the steps. But here's the, here's the. When I tried to explain why you cannot be enlightened from reading a book, I really, I use this particular metaphor. If you look at the oriental practices, any of them Buddhism, there's always a master student relationship. Sure, okay? Yep. And the master says, wax on, wax off, right? The student, of course, rebels. And all that kind of stuff. Right. But at some point in time the student has an awakening or some level of awareness has increased in their consciousness. Right? And then the master says, ah Ha, now here's how you got here. Up until that point, the student doesn't know what they don't know because you can't. How do you, how do you explain to somebody what it feels like to be in a state of I am.

Speaker 2: And just be. So there are steps, but I come to them eventually. You can't tell me what they are. No, because I lead you. I would, if I were teaching or whatever you would want to call it. I don't, you know, mentoring thing, if you were tenzing norgay my Edward Sir Edmund Hillary. Yeah. It's, you know, it's an experience. Um, so yeah, lead you through this process. And sometimes if there are thinkers, which is a disease. Okay, sure. Yeah. Thinking is a disease. Absolutely. Tell me how that's true. Well, how much control you have over your thoughts. I fair amount. I feel like I have a fair amount. Do I not? Are you saying that because I'm actually within these days and times, right? It's all a little bit wacky. What's happening, right. So everybody's particular facet of what you're talking about, the political system, Geo politics and everything, you know, it's, it's all kind of up in the air type of thing.

Speaker 2: Uh, what, whatever we're doing now, we weren't doing kind of then, you know what I mean? Absolutely. Thank God. Yeah. So I'm trying to think as much as I can, you know, and I, I come, you know, for, as far as politics is concerned, I kind of come from a we philosophy as opposed to an eye philosophy and now I'm thinking, okay, maybe it's actually we plus, I, you know, that type of stuff. Why do what, why isn't there just one? Why isn't there just one of those outcomes because people are involved because unconscious people are involved. Would be what I think to say right there. Yeah. Boy, this guy, that would be a very, very long conversation. We can't do that. We cannot do that when I have to come back. And maybe that's another. Well, because it's like, so not tied in Canada. That's fair enough.

Speaker 2: So there are some, um, uh, uh, and I just heard this because like we have this theory that you can affect the plant with your mind. Okay. Right. Because I'm taking my world of consciousness. Sure. My world of conscious of cannabis and saying, you know, do you have an effect on a plant if you are interacting with it? Our theory is that yes, you can. Okay. I have an effect on that plant. Um, and I just heard from Reggie. Yeah, I'm from on your team on my team, right? Who is a phd in molecular genetics and all kinds of other really long, very big worthy name is etc. Okay. That lOts of american indians, um, their interaction with cannabis was such that they would commune, let's call it the application. No, I haven't really started to really dig into, kind of like, all right, what are you talking about?

Speaker 2: Commune with the plant and the plant would deliver whatever medicine, that particular person that grew it needed. I'm like, wow, This is fascinating. Yeah. And he's saying that's possible. Yeah. But he said that indians did it, so I don't know. Well, that's interesting. That's interesting to affecting myself, but then Affecting the planet with my own kind of consciousness. Not thinking, well, here's, here's what we don't. We don't seem to get. Okay. Everything is conscious. Everything is. Everything is aware. How do you mean? Well, here, let's take the smallest, um, thIng that, you know, let's say it's just a, a, a, like how to ride a bike. No, no, no. I'm talking about a elemental particle. Okay. Like, and I had them, right. And that's not get into quantum physics is that would you can affect that also? Fine. I have no idea. I would be out over my skis. Alright, let's say I'm a cell in your, uh, cell fair enough.

Speaker 2: So here's how he describe, or here's how I explained to them everything has some level of consciousness because a cell must know what it is not. Okay. Right. Because it will defend itself. Like let's say if you over cancer cell. Okay. It's very aggressive. It knows what it is and what it knows, what it is, not. how can you have that? How can you defend your viewer cell, protect yourself from things attacking you if you don't know where you begin and end. Right? So when you look at consciousness at that microscopic level, like, well, okay, every cell in everything has some level of awareness, some level of consciousness. And obviously the plant has lots of that in it. Sure, sure. And then as far as a human, this is too, I can't believe we're talking about this. I think it's fantastic and we're going to have to have like three more episodes of just this with you, but you know, uh, as far as humans coming back to humans and, and consciousness, when did you kind of come upon this?

Speaker 2: Right? So you're, you're making every job that you have a software job and it was this eventual thinking or is this all along the way or? I was not thinking, right? Well, no, because I was a thinker. Right, okay. Yeah. Which is highly overrated. I understand because most of it's white noise. So most of the thoughts you have, you're actually not producing, right? You don't have control over those thoughts. They just pop up and we could get into all the reasons why thoughts pop up, whatever, whatever. Um, um, where does that go with that? Um, the, the, the, uh, thinking not a being overrated, being totally overrated. It's so much better to not think and then deliberately think when you really want to think about something like when you have a problem to solve and when you choose to think, okay, you're applying laser focused attention to a problem that you want to solve.

Speaker 2: It's like takiNg your brain and turning it into a super computer to solve a particular problem when you're existing in a state of white noise all the time where you're constantly being dragged around by the universe. Because most of the thoughts that we have are just a reaction to everything else around us. They have nothing to do with us. Reactionary there. Yeah. And we just, one thought leads to another and lIke when you have a thought, it goes, I, I tend to translate things into like hopefully understandable terms is like, let's say that there's a whiteboard in your brain and, and that you can write on that whiteboard your thoughts really right on it, right? But if you don't give him any juice, then they just fade away. That's how your brain works. Sure. Okay. Um, so if you don't give it, so if you have a random thought and you choose not to give it energy, any attention.

Speaker 2: Okay, sure. Then it'll just die. It just fade away. Okay. I called it like let the leaf drift down the stream. Just let it go. Just let it go with no attention. The problem is that we feed our thoughts, like we go like, well, if that's true, then what does this mean and left? And then it just goes on and we get this whole thread, whatever. That started with some random thoughts that we had no control over in the first place. So I'm thinking you're all about, I solve a problem with your thinking as opposed to the white noise thinking. Well, it depends on whether you want to be dragged around by the universe or not. It doesn't sound like that much fun to me. Although realizing that most people are kind of in that state and most of the time, absolutely not in control of anything that's happening, including myself until right now.

Speaker 2: Okay, great. You've been awakened to indeed. So you and you become awakened and realized that you must live in holland. So you go right to, uh, uh, to, uh, to the Netherlands and you've settled that lift and lift. Right? Where does cannabis come into this? I'm not for a long time actually. So I moved. All right. So I needed an office in the, in europe for my software company, the other company, right? Yep. And um, and when, when we were deciding as like where could we possibly live in the world, it's like, you know, we had a bunch of dutch friends and then he started telling me about deadlift and um, I went, I'm pretty impulsive or are I make quick decisions. Ten days later I got on a plane and I went to delft and I'm like, I could live here. It's a university town. Sure.

Speaker 2: It's got, it's called a university called delft, which is really advanced technology wise and computers and architecture and all of the perfect. Yeah, it's perfect. And like, oh great. I liked the energy in a university town and it's kinda like amsterdam. It's, I call it amsterdam without the sex, drugs and rock and roll. So there are no coffee shops are, there are. Oh, there are, but they're not quite as, they're, they're just places that you could go by. We're not, they're not quite. Not that I would go there because it's not safe. They're not quite as cd is a pun intended. Yes. And you know, there's no red light district and you know, the rock and roll is just a little bit more. It has to end at 11. I got. Gotcha. So cannabis is there, right? Canvases around. When did you start paying attention to it

Speaker 2: but wasn't in amsterdam as a business? Um, it was kind of like, so when I sold the software company was in 2012 and my children all worked for the software company. My oldest grew up in it and wrote his first commercial piece of software and he was 13 and the other two were still in college at that point in time. Um, and like when we, it was a family decision to sell the software company because it was always going to be one of those were always working together as a family. Um, and that was just part of my goals going back to la when jeremy, who's my oldest was two years old, I'm like, this is the way, this is what I want for my life. I don't want my children. So it gets all emotional when I talk about my children. So I just have to do, is cover. Okay. It's a beautiful thing. I want to spend my time with them, right. I don't want them to move to some other place and never interfaced with them on a daily basis. And especially because I treated them like adults since they reached the age of reason. Um, so we have a there,

Speaker 2: there you go. Same with those emotional fakes again. It's like they're my best friends. That's a beautiful thing. I mean

Speaker 2: I don't have kids right with, with just the mere thought of the kids kinda kinda makes you kind of really does kind of go. So at that point in time. So when I sold I had a bunch of money. Okay. Bunch of cash, cash, cash, but mostly like in bank accounts and um, they were two were still in school at that point in time. So like I just looked around and like, you know, first I'd like all right, I'm just gonna chill. Okay. That lasted for about a couple months. Um, because like there's so many beats walks you can take and then you're like, all right, now what? Okay, I'm great. I'm totally rested, um, so I jumped into real estate and I like jumping into things that I know nothing about. That's my preferred state of being because I don't have a lot of paradigms like pre judgments on how things should be.

Speaker 2: Sure. Um, so the, I view that as an asset. Absolutely. Worst thing that you can do is the thing that you do because we've always done it that way, right? So I, you know, I looked at real estate, I'm like, you know, and entered student housing and europe, when you look at the financial meltdown of real estate, it, like europe was years behind the us. Okay. So, um, in 2012, which is when I sold 'em, um, I liked, looked at real estate and it's like, um, I mean any university town, right? So there's lots of students are shown and unlike the dutch viewpoint is, it's called how's the milker, which I think is milk all the money out of the house. Okay. Which is means you're not investing any money. You're just like, you're one of those terrible landlord. And I'm like, all right, that doesn't really sound like a label I want to really put on myself.

Speaker 2: Um, And I looked at the market and said, well, what if I do everything completely different? Yeah. And I'm going to completely renovate the properties, um, and I'm going to charge the highest rent in, in the city students because they'll actually pay, they'll pay more than a couple or a family will, they're going to pay more disposable, more. Well, it's coming from their parents, so it's their disposable income coming in parents and so, and then, you know, the kind of things that we're doing. We're just restructuring buildings to be what I thought would be attractive to the student market. And um, that was reallY, uh, worked really well. I put together, I was like, you know, put together a construction basically construction company. I didn't own the company, But it's all right, here's what I need from czechoslovakia because I need a full time crew working on all my houses.

Speaker 2: Um, so I have 50, fIfty houses, 50 properties, um, in, in delft still there. Okay. That was my goal. Fifty. Great. Um, and it was like about when did I get bored as soon as, as soon as I have to do it, as soon as I'm not challenged anymore. Okay. I'm going to do it a few more times just to make sure it's like, did I miss anything? But I'm at s don't ask me to do the same thing over and over again. It's just not Who I am. Um, so that was like the end of 2014. I was already getting pretty bored and we started looking around. It's like, all right. The youngest too had, had graduated from college at that point in time. And I'm like, all right, well what are we going to go do? You know, which definitely had a software focus for sure.

Speaker 2: Yeah. Um, and we looked at replacements for email as a possible market that we would start a company in and then it long keep slack. Alright, next state did a good job. They did a good job. We use slack. Okay. So I'm a believer in it. But um, and then also I just. And so at that point in time, this was april of 2000 and yeah, and I just happened to randomly google cannabis investing. InTeresting. And arcview popped up and I'm like, because I had thought about it like a year before, but uh, what's this cannabis thing from the cannabis world? Whatever, you know. Um, and I immediately signed up with a spot, so I bought my plane ticket before they even approved me. Right. Yeah. Um, it's like, all right, I'm going to go. I'm in all in. I called, I called the kids, I'm saying, all right, this is it. This is what we're going to do. We're going to open a family office. Um, which we did and started investing in cannabis. And then when did steep hill happened? Well, I went to the first arc view was in the end of April, 2015 and steep hill was one of the first two companies that I invested in and I looked at it and like, oh, well this should be a software technology and big data company that happens to do lab testing. Okay. How important is lab testing in cannabis?

Speaker 2: I'm easily, I could be dead right now, not as, so Canada is totally safe. Okay. It's all the shit we do with it. Makes it not safe. Okay. Yeah. Um, and my particular experience resulted in me passing out and cutting my ear in half as I fell. Um, so that easily I could have been dead, you know, so that's the kind of risk that's actually out there and that I'm not immune compromised or whatever. It's just like, it definitely is an awakening, you know? And um, so, you know, it has this kind of like, it has like different roles in the industry, you know, I mean it created, it was the first cannabis laboratory in the world other than the da and they're testing it for obviously much different reasons and they really don't do a great job. But anyway, but that's a whole different.

Speaker 2: That's a different story. Um, so I'm, I'm it because it was the evolution of, of a need. Okay. And it was really steve de angelo that when he, when he opened harborside, he's like, well, how can we put medicine in front of patients and not know what's in it? Right? Can't do that. You can't do that. We've got to know something. So he was one of the founders of steep hill. So that's. So when you look at it from that perspective, it's a patient perspective. It is not a business perspective. I do not think that he like, oh, let me, you know, let me help co steep pill, I'm going to make a ton of money. it's, you know, it's not necessarily historically been a profitable business because telling the truth is not profitable. Right? People don't like to hear that. No, they don't. Um, and so are you guys now though, how big are we?

Speaker 2: What meaning how many countries? Um, so, um, we have country, a company owned labs in California, New Mexico and Washington. Last year we licensed Hawaii, Alaska, Maryland, Pennsylvania, and Washington dc, which scares me a little bit. um, we already had a joint venture in Jamaica with the, with a university called utec. We now finally have regulations and we are gonna fire that went up as well. Um, we just aNnounced a joint venTure in Israel with icann, which is going to be phenomenal. The kind of things because it's like having a presence and that, that lab is more in r and d lab than a production lab because there's just, there's certainly a grower, so okay, there's not that much cannabis to test, but medicinally speaking, they're doing research that is so far ahead of the world because there's legal you can actually do, you can do that.

Speaker 2: You can do clinical trials. Imagine that. Okay. Um, but interjecting that level of science into, into the steep hill family, if you want to call it that, because I look at it as all one thing to me, of course, a collaboration of stakeholders that we need to empower, right? Safe patient access. Well, not just that, but on all the different viewpoints. So steep hill started as a laboratory, but that it's so much more than that now, you know, um, what is it, what is it? It's really, it's a hard thing to almost describe to people. So if you look at it from a timeline standpoint, yes, first, first lab 2008, and they were doing, you know, at that point in time, just potency testing. Um, and then from there, I think historically the first other business, if you want to call it that was remote testing and that was the original quanta can and which is a near infrared technology where you can get the potency out of a, out of a flower.

Speaker 2: Okay. In 60 seconds. Okay. Um, what came reggie describes, which is fascinating, right? Um, yeah, and now there's multiple evolutions of that. Um, I think historically, probably genetics Was our next move at that point in time. We sequenced the first mail sequence of the plan and which allowed us to learn a whole lot that nobody knew because nobody had ever done this sequence of cannabis before. Um, I'm not even sure if there's any long read sequences out there to this day that they're short read sequences. It gives you a little little snippet. Okay. That's not the same as the full sequence, which is kind of like the dakota ring because you have to take all those little snippets of dna and you have to, oh, where does that fit in? This really long thing. SO you've got to have one of those long read sequencing, the decoder ring or the coin of the realm for that matter.

Speaker 2: I'll go for that. Um, and then we started licensing. So, um, which I'm a software guy, right? I want to invest a bunch of money in the beginning and then I want to, you know, sell it over and over again for nothing. Right? That's a software guy for you. AbsolutEly. Yeah, absolutely. And so, uh, we have tragically no more time left. So I'm going to ask you the three final question. Final question for this interview, but what we, the next time we see each other some place. Sometime you have got to toss again. We've got to do this again. We should do this every time. See each. There we go. That's the deal. That's a deal. But are. Then you just pick a topic randomly. We sit down, you know, in the court yard, and we'd just talk and we just talk three final questions. I'll tEll you what they are. I'll ask you them in order. What has most surprised you in cannabis? What has most surprised you in life? And then on the soundtrack of your life, one track, one song that's got to be on there. First things first, what has most surprised you in cannabis?

Speaker 2: Um, this is, this is probably not the answer that you're going to expect, which of course that's probably what you expect. I'm expecting. So when I, when I entered, when I started becoming more and more involved in, in steep hill, I had this viewpoint of science, right? That they were, the scientists were the, they were about truth and justice and like seeking knowledge and they would never lie. Okay. Would they. I, I had a paradigm. Okay. I had a paradigm that scientists were, they stood for all the things that truth would say. Okay. And thEn I got exposed to Washington dc dc know Washington state. I see. And they were doing it and what they were. I mean, there are numerous bad actors, there are numerous scientists there that lie. Okay, that sell. What result do you want here? You pay enough, you can have any result you want, you can pass any test you want.

Speaker 2: Okay. And that was a huge blow for me. Yeah. Because it crushed my viewpoint of science that people would do that and that the ramifications that, you know, that would have potentially for everything downstream. Right? Fundamentally, first and foremost, the patient consumer, they're the ultimate, you know, person who is at risk here, but for everyone in the food chain, it's like, this is not the way to do it. YeaH. You know, that was probably. That was the biggest awakening for me. And thank you for trying to help solve that issue. Right? I think we're, we're away from that now. You know what I mean? Just Where we're in a better place where. Alright, improvements are being made. That's what we're saying. Okay. What has most surprised you in life? What has surprised me most in life

Speaker 2: was it you're kind of coming to consciousness because that. Oh yeah, that you can choose, be happy. All the time if you want to. I. That's pretty huge. Let's, let's go with that one. Okay. It really is a choice. You don't have to go through all this shit we go through. Yeah. It really is. You're a little creation that you're creating for yourself. I'm calm, kind of 80 percent there. You know, I've, I've come a long way over the past few years and recognizing that I can be happy all the time. I'm 80 percent there. Okay. Not 100 percent, but I'm close. But you don't want to be totally ever 100 percent happy. I tried that for six months too much. No, it's like it's boring. Oh, okay. And it also becomes, it's like when you're, when you're like happy all the time, or what you used to say is your baseline for happiness, right?

Speaker 2: Yeah. Then you need to have more happiness before you'd even recognize the fact that you're happy, right? yes. So you actually need a couple of peaks and valleys occasionally. Just kind of knowing how to get in. Yeah. Because you can choose to be in and out of them at choice. I think it's a nax amanda. I think that there's a greek philosopher that kind of speaks to that, you know, the kind of, the you need the double edge sword you need, they're really two sides. They're really the two sides of the coin. How would you know? Good. Without evil. There you go. On the soundtrack of jane michelle's life. One track, one song that's got to be on there.

Speaker 3: Um,

Speaker 2: fireflies, but I don't do, I know that. I feel like I should know that you said it. Like I do know it a shit I'm like so insane how current is. It isn't as like from the seventies, the now the now a male singer, a female singer. Um, it's a gate. Okay. Okay. Thomas dolby? No. Oh, okay. Who all write for fireflies? How about this? Alright, well, I'm gonna I never remember the names of songs. I'll tell fact it actually got the name of the song for you. It's my ring. Take the wheel, take the win, and then we'll tell them who. Who does it? Yeah. This is actually, can you guess. Okay. Because if you call me, it'll be my ring tone. Okay. And then we can, you could record that and then you can let everyone guess what the real song is because you know, I was like, all right, here's a huge revelation for you.

Speaker 2: Okay. I'm an off the scale introvert. That's amazing. Off the scale. Okay. So on a myers brigg test, I only answer one question that would have any attachment to being extroverted. My preferred state mad scientists in the basement. Yeah, that's good. That's where I'm good. They're going to a party and being around people, it's just an adaptation. It's like, wow, this introvert things not working out very well. I'm going to have to talk to people while you're doing that. Pretty well, michelle. Thank you very much. Appreciate it. Great too. It was a blast. Absolutely. And there you have jay, Michelle Keller. So fireflies. My best bet is it's our city. I was not

Speaker 1: aware before I looked it up, but uh, there you have it. Very much appreciated. Uh, speaking with jay. Michelle. This is someone who is an enlightened being. right? Thanks to him. Thanks to you for listening. Stay tuned.

Read the full transcript:

Become a member to access to webinars, quarterly reports, contributor columns, shows, excerpts, and complete podcast transcripts

Become a Member

Already a member? Login here.

Subscribe now to get every episode.

Cannabis Economy is a real-time history of legal cannabis. We chronicle how personal and industry histories have combined to provide our current reality.